NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you give an opinion of a person or company your full name needs to be in your post. Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Postwar Sportscard Forums > Watercooler Talk- ALL sports talk

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 04-12-2017, 01:56 PM
bn2cardz's Avatar
bn2cardz bn2cardz is offline
Х r
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Missouri
Posts: 2,580
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KMayUSA6060 View Post
Do you know any Native Americans offended by it?

I'm a big fan of Chief Wahoo. Simple as that. Most Cleveland fans are. We all grew up with the smiling cartoon.

I believe CBS did a study a couple years back that around 85-90% of Native Americans are NOT offended by the logo. So whose war is this? I won't answer that on this board, and will refrain from all political talk.

Here's something to think about. If Chief Wahoo is offensive, what about the Notre Dame Fighting Irish depicting a stereotypical leprechaun with red hair in an aggressive manner? What about the New York Yankees name potentially offending southerners? What about the Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim offending people of non-Christian faith? The petty, offensive crap can go on and on if you let it.

Leprechauns are fictional/mythical creatures from Irish folklore they are not a people group. Also what version of the logo are you referencing with the red hair?
Yankee is a term for any American with Yankee Doodle being a song from the revolutionary war. Damn Yankee would be a more southern/northern term. Also the region of the country is not an inherent heritage.
Los Angeles Angels is a play on the city name. Just as San Diego Padres is (surprised you didn't bring that one up). They really would have to change the city name to remove the "offensive words".

Native Americans are an actual set of people that are being stereotyped. Your comparisons aren't similar.


Quote:
Originally Posted by KMayUSA6060 View Post
So then why the need to rebrand in the first place? If fans will be fans no matter what, then why the need to rebrand? The 15% of the fan base that finds a name/logo offensive will still be fans, right?

Putting words in my mouth. You even had the quote right there and you still got it wrong. I did not says "fans will be fans no matter what". I said they wouldn't lose fans, they may gain some though.

Those 15% that you claim are offended could potentially not be buying any Cleveland merchandise currently due to the logo or term "Indians".

Also you will not see me protesting any team's logo, but that doesn't mean I have to be hostile towards those that are. A little empathy and compassion can go a long way.
__________________
Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal, but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. Matthew 6:19-21

Last edited by bn2cardz; 04-12-2017 at 02:00 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 04-12-2017, 01:59 PM
bn2cardz's Avatar
bn2cardz bn2cardz is offline
Х r
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Missouri
Posts: 2,580
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikemb View Post
I see no problem with re branding, but it should be the team's choice, not someone telling them to do it.

Mike
No it should be the owner of the overall brand. In this case that is MLB. Just because you own a McDonald's Franchise restaurant doesn't mean you no longer are held accountable to the Branding dictated by corporate.
__________________
Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal, but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. Matthew 6:19-21
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 04-12-2017, 02:18 PM
packs packs is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3,958
Default

I do know Native Americans who are offended by the logo and those same Native Americans would prefer Washington change their name as well.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 04-12-2017, 02:23 PM
pclpads pclpads is offline
Dave Foster
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: left coast
Posts: 609
Default

Welcome to the age of PC.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 04-12-2017, 02:39 PM
KMayUSA6060 KMayUSA6060 is offline
Kyle May
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Northeast Ohio
Posts: 515
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bn2cardz View Post
Leprechauns are fictional/mythical creatures from Irish folklore they are not a people group. Also what version of the logo are you referencing with the red hair?
Yankee is a term for any American with Yankee Doodle being a song from the revolutionary war. Damn Yankee would be a more southern/northern term. Also the region of the country is not an inherent heritage.
Los Angeles Angels is a play on the city name. Just as San Diego Padres is (surprised you didn't bring that one up). They really would have to change the city name to remove the "offensive words".

Native Americans are an actual set of people that are being stereotyped. Your comparisons aren't similar.

Putting words in my mouth. You even had the quote right there and you still got it wrong. I did not says "fans will be fans no matter what". I said they wouldn't lose fans, they may gain some though.

Those 15% that you claim are offended could potentially not be buying any Cleveland merchandise currently due to the logo or term "Indians".

Also you will not see me protesting any team's logo, but that doesn't mean I have to be hostile towards those that are. A little empathy and compassion can go a long way.
1) I'm referring to the live mascot. The logo has "black" facial hair which is just a cover up to make it more PC. And the Irish are a group of people by the way, and so depicting the leprechaun in an aggressive manner, with all Irish traits, would technically be stereotyping the Irish. Not that I care, nor do I think anyone should, just saying.

2/3) Would rebranding in return lose fans though? And would they lose more fans, and sell less merchandise if they rebranded? I'd say there's a good chance. The block C doesn't sell as well as Chief Wahoo I don't believe.

You're saying that the rebrand would almost guarantee a stronger following, but I don't think it would. Like I said, most Indians fans like Chief Wahoo, and it's not like a Cubs fan is going to jump onto the Indians bandwagon all of a sudden.
__________________
Faith. Family. Country. Baseball. Baseball Cards.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 04-12-2017, 02:40 PM
KMayUSA6060 KMayUSA6060 is offline
Kyle May
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Northeast Ohio
Posts: 515
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by packs View Post
I do know Native Americans who are offended by the logo and those same Native Americans would prefer Washington change their name as well.
Are they mostly Native American blood, or are they less than 20% Native American?
__________________
Faith. Family. Country. Baseball. Baseball Cards.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 04-12-2017, 02:44 PM
packs packs is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3,958
Default

I never thought to ask.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 04-12-2017, 02:57 PM
KMayUSA6060 KMayUSA6060 is offline
Kyle May
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Northeast Ohio
Posts: 515
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by packs View Post
I never thought to ask.
To me, it makes a difference. If you're 1% Native American, I don't think you should be allowed to be "offended". Haha.
__________________
Faith. Family. Country. Baseball. Baseball Cards.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 04-12-2017, 04:49 PM
steve B steve B is offline
Steve Birmingham
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: eastern Mass.
Posts: 4,075
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bn2cardz View Post
Also the region of the country is not an inherent heritage.
.
You're obviously not from any part of New England.
There are still plenty of places where even if your family moved there 100 years ago you're "from away"

Steve B
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 04-12-2017, 07:52 PM
irv's Avatar
irv irv is offline
D@le Irv*n
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Ontario, Canada.
Posts: 2,469
Default

http://www.chathamdailynews.ca/2016/...me-controversy
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Variation of a Chief Wahoo? ajenks3378 Net54baseball Sports (Primarily) Vintage Memorabilia Forum incl. Game Used 2 02-12-2017 05:29 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:36 AM.


ebay GSB