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  #1  
Old 01-10-2019, 02:07 PM
Copa7's Avatar
Copa7 Copa7 is offline
Chuck Zso.lnai
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: New York / Florida
Posts: 284
Default white whale landed !

I had been searching for this card which I have only seen once before.

World record goals/game holder. Franz "Bimbo" Binder. Austria/Germany and Rapid

2018-12-21-11-11-28

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franz_Binder
__________________
Collecting vintage soccer
Collecting pre-war baseball
Collecting vintage horse racing (wanted: tobacco cards and pins)
Set in progress: 1994 Upper Deck World Cup autographed
Set in progress: 1938 Konig Fussball
Sub set in progress: 1910-12 Sweet Caporal pins - Philadelphia Athletics - 4 of 11 complete (need: Baker, Murphy, Plank, Krause, Davis)

Successful transactions:
aro13
edsj
commishbob
jpaol99
Gonzo,
abroom
Brianp-beme
Dboneesq

Last edited by Copa7; 01-10-2019 at 02:12 PM.
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  #2  
Old 01-10-2019, 04:53 PM
Collect Equity's Avatar
Collect Equity Collect Equity is offline
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Jonathan Rys.kamp
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
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Default Awesome!!!

Congrats on the pickup. It’s always fun to get a card crossed off the list.

Would you also please post a view of the back? I’d love to see which variation it is.

Question: Why was this card a white whale for you? This set is not overly rare or hard to come by.
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  #3  
Old 01-10-2019, 04:57 PM
Arazi4442 Arazi4442 is offline
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Congratulations Chuck!

Personally, I don't know much about that set but you can bet whenever I land a long sought after card, I'll be singing it from the rooftops.
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  #4  
Old 01-12-2019, 10:05 AM
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Copa7 Copa7 is offline
Chuck Zso.lnai
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: New York / Florida
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Collect Equity View Post
Congrats on the pickup. It’s always fun to get a card crossed off the list.

Would you also please post a view of the back? I’d love to see which variation it is.

Question: Why was this card a white whale for you? This set is not overly rare or hard to come by.
2018-12-21-11-13-01

Here is a picture of the back. There are at least 4 variations on the reverse sponsors. While you say the set is not rare, I have two albums from this series. Neither has a slot for this and several of the Austrian players who were "annexed" to the German league and then to the German National Team. So while some cards may be abundant, others may be in a later series that appears to be scarce.

If you have other information on this set, if be interested.
__________________
Collecting vintage soccer
Collecting pre-war baseball
Collecting vintage horse racing (wanted: tobacco cards and pins)
Set in progress: 1994 Upper Deck World Cup autographed
Set in progress: 1938 Konig Fussball
Sub set in progress: 1910-12 Sweet Caporal pins - Philadelphia Athletics - 4 of 11 complete (need: Baker, Murphy, Plank, Krause, Davis)

Successful transactions:
aro13
edsj
commishbob
jpaol99
Gonzo,
abroom
Brianp-beme
Dboneesq
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  #5  
Old 01-12-2019, 12:28 PM
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Collect Equity Collect Equity is offline
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Jonathan Rys.kamp
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 123
Default Great Info!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Copa7 View Post
While you say the set is not rare, I have two albums from this series. Neither has a slot for this and several of the Austrian players who were "annexed" to the German league and then to the German National Team. So while some cards may be abundant, others may be in a later series that appears to be scarce.
That is really interesting to note. I only collect 3 cards from this set (see my previous post on this), so I am not familiar with the set as a whole. Can you share which cards are easier and harder to find?

Maybe others can chime in and share this as well, so that we can share this knowledge.

Also, since I am trying for a master set of backs for the 3 players I collect, I'd love any information on which backs others find the most rare.

Are you also going for all 4 backs of every player in order to call the set complete?




Quote:
Originally Posted by Copa7 View Post
If you have other information on this set, if be interested.
Here are the best resources I am aware of for this set:
  1. Current Checklist: https://cartophilic-info-exch.blogsp...ssball-09.html
  2. Back Variations:https://cartophilic-info-exch.blogsp...-fussball.html
  3. Detailed Set Info:http://www.csogb.co.uk/Reference/Mul...igFussball.php

By the way, on the csogb.co.uk site link above, there is a matrix with each card being listed as "U, T, Z" but I can't figure out what that designation is referring to. Can anyone help me out on this?

I too am really interested in this set and would love any knowledge that people can share on it. Thanks to everyone for helping us learn more about these classic old sets!!!!
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  #6  
Old 01-12-2019, 02:26 PM
thelimey thelimey is offline
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It wasn't clear to me either at first but I took the U, T, Z to refer to the cigarette factory in bold at the foot of the card. U is for Union (Ramona & Nilprincess backs), T for Turbacco (Turbacco & Nordmark) & Z for Zepter (Solo).

I have a Binder with the same back too. I wonder whether is there is an order to the back variations, eg is it based on location or date of release. FWIW most of the dozen or so "Ausland" & "Ostmark" I have are on the 2 narrow Ramon / Nilprincess variations.
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  #7  
Old 01-12-2019, 03:26 PM
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CW CW is offline
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Congrats, Chuck! Cool looking card.
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  #8  
Old 01-12-2019, 03:43 PM
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Jonathan Rys.kamp
 
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Default Ditto

Quote:
Originally Posted by thelimey View Post
FWIW most of the dozen or so "Ausland" & "Ostmark" I have are on the 2 narrow Ramon / Nilprincess variations.
I agree that the most common seem to be the two "NilPrincess / Ramona (narrow)" variations.
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  #9  
Old 01-12-2019, 04:22 PM
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Collect Equity Collect Equity is offline
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Jonathan Rys.kamp
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 123
Default New Variations???

I was comparing the variations of the backs of my cards, and I noticed what seems to be already known, but not cataloged variations.

On the two Narrow NilPrincess / Ramona variations, the primary identification of a difference between them is the with and without the "In Vorbereitung" clause. And on this site, both of the examples of the middle paragraphs begin with the word "Sammelalbum."

However, in looking at my cards I have another Narrow NilPrincess / Ramona without "In Vorbereitung" clause variation and in the middle section it begins with the word 'Prachtv' in the first paragraph and 'Dazu' instead of 'Zu' in the second paragraph.


When I looked at the back examples listed on Alan Jenkins' site, he shows this same back in his example.

So there are is a new variation right there.

Additionally, it appears that the Solo no "In Vorbereitung" clause "Postscheckkonto" on this site also contains the "Prachtv-Dazu" opening words but the one on Alan's site does not, which means there is another variation again.

In a very small sample 2 of the 15 known variations include the "Prachtv-Dazu" wording (including two different brands), so my guess is that other variations also include the "Prachtv-Dazu" wording as well - potentially this could even double the variation count.

This means that the number of variations now has jumped to at least 17, with a whole bunch more possible:
  1. 08 Turbaco (Blue) - with "In Vorbereitung" clause
  2. 08 Turbaco - with "In Vorbereitung" clause
  3. 08 Turbaco (Blue) - without "In Vorbereitung" clause
  4. 0.8 Nordmark (Blue)
  5. NilPrincess / Ramona (wide)
  6. NilPrincess / Ramona (narrow); with "In Vorbereitung" clause
  7. NilPrincess / Ramona (narrow); without "In Vorbereitung" clause without "Prachtv/Dazu" paragraphs
  8. NilPrincess / Ramona (narrow); without "In Vorbereitung" clause with "Prachtv/Dazu" paragraphs
  9. Ramona (brand name to left)
  10. Ramona (brand name to centre); with "früher 4 Pf"
  11. Ramona (brand name to centre); without "früher 4 Pf"
  12. Solo - (Medium); without "In Vorbereitung" clause; with "Postscheckkonto" without "Prachtv/Dazu" paragraphs
  13. Solo - (Medium); without "In Vorbereitung" clause; with "Postscheckkonto" with "Prachtv/Dazu" paragraphs
  14. Solo - (Small); with "In Vorbereitung" clause; with "Postscheckkonto"
  15. Solo - (Medium); with "In Vorbereitung" clause; with "Postscheckkonto"
  16. Solo - (Large - separated from "3⅓"); with "In Vorbereitung" clause; with "Postscheckkonto"
  17. Solo - (Large - separated from "3⅓"); with "In Vorbereitung" clause; without "Postscheckkonto"

Am I missing something or does this match what everyone else is seeing?

Does anyone else have any other "Prachtv/Dazu" paragraph backs?

If this is indeed the case, I don't know whether to jump for joy because I discovered a new variation, or to cry because I now have to go track them down. This set is getting so incredibly complex for a back-collector-completist like me
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  #10  
Old 01-15-2019, 11:43 AM
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Anish Anish is offline
Ani.sh Kan.abar
 
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Beauty card - congrats on finding one!
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  #11  
Old 01-15-2019, 03:40 PM
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Copa7 Copa7 is offline
Chuck Zso.lnai
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: New York / Florida
Posts: 284
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Collect Equity View Post
That is really interesting to note. I only collect 3 cards from this set (see my previous post on this), so I am not familiar with the set as a whole. Can you share which cards are easier and harder to find?

Maybe others can chime in and share this as well, so that we can share this knowledge.

Also, since I am trying for a master set of backs for the 3 players I collect, I'd love any information on which backs others find the most rare.

Are you also going for all 4 backs of every player in order to call the set complete?






Here are the best resources I am aware of for this set:
  1. Current Checklist: https://cartophilic-info-exch.blogsp...ssball-09.html
  2. Back Variations:https://cartophilic-info-exch.blogsp...-fussball.html
  3. Detailed Set Info:http://www.csogb.co.uk/Reference/Mul...igFussball.php

By the way, on the csogb.co.uk site link above, there is a matrix with each card being listed as "U, T, Z" but I can't figure out what that designation is referring to. Can anyone help me out on this?

I too am really interested in this set and would love any knowledge that people can share on it. Thanks to everyone for helping us learn more about these classic old sets!!!!
I know for a fact that the checklist on the 3rd site is incomplete. It's missing Ireland, Holland and Portugal in the last section. And as I mentioned, the Austrian players were a later series, after the annexation.

But it does give a better idea how vast the set is and why some cards are more common while others rarer.

The U, T, Z is for the designation of variants - Union, Tutbaco, Zeptor .
__________________
Collecting vintage soccer
Collecting pre-war baseball
Collecting vintage horse racing (wanted: tobacco cards and pins)
Set in progress: 1994 Upper Deck World Cup autographed
Set in progress: 1938 Konig Fussball
Sub set in progress: 1910-12 Sweet Caporal pins - Philadelphia Athletics - 4 of 11 complete (need: Baker, Murphy, Plank, Krause, Davis)

Successful transactions:
aro13
edsj
commishbob
jpaol99
Gonzo,
abroom
Brianp-beme
Dboneesq

Last edited by Copa7; 01-15-2019 at 03:45 PM.
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  #12  
Old 01-17-2019, 12:23 PM
Collect Equity's Avatar
Collect Equity Collect Equity is offline
J.
Jonathan Rys.kamp
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 123
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Copa7 View Post
I know for a fact that the checklist on the 3rd site is incomplete. It's missing Ireland, Holland and Portugal in the last section. And as I mentioned, the Austrian players were a later series, after the annexation.
Yes, that page does seem out of date. At the top it says the set has 340+3 different cards, but then in the checklist grid below it only has a little over 300 of those listed. Also, the back checklist is not near complete, as I have a number of different brand backs for players that aren't marked. That said, it is a daunting checklist to put together and I am impressed with how much is there. My guess is they just haven't had time to update it yet, since it's a such a large and dynamic project.

What about the checklist on the FCIE:
https://cartophilic-info-exch.blogsp...ssball-09.html

It lists the set at 343 players and lists them all out. Do you know of any players in the set that are not on that list?
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